The conversations with M.Karunanidhi’s daughter M. Kanimozhi about keeping Dayanidhi Maran out from negotiations with the Congress and to get the telecom portfolio for A. Raja
The Raja-Radia Tapes
Four transcripts that were submitted to the SC along with a total of eight recordings in May 2009 covering the cabinet formation, DMK politics and who’d get telecom portfolio
We have not edited or changed the style or spellings used in the transcripts submitted to court. Please allow a few seconds to elapse before the recordings begin.
Audio Files:
- 06-188819-0-03-20090522-014237
- 11-188819-0-31-20090524-110511
- 28-188819-0-19-20090522-132029
- A Raja50-188819-0-27-20090523-142941
- A Raja-06-188819-0-03-20090522-014237
- A Raja-28-188819-0-19-20090522-132029
- A Raja–11-188819-0-31-20090524-110511
Transcripts
22 May 2009, 09:48:51
Nira: Hello?
Raja: Raja here
Nira: Hi! I got a message from Barkha Dutt just now
Raja: Huh?
Nira: Barkha Dutt
Raja: What does she say?
Nira: She says… that she has been following up the story with Prime Minister’s tonight. In fact, she was the one who told me that Sonia Gandhi went there. She says that he has no problem with you, but he has a problem with Baalu
Raja: …but it has to be discussed with Leader
Nira: yeah, yeah… he has to discuss with the Leader. He has to tell…
Raja: It will be discussed in the morning… why unnecessarily Congress… [indiscernible] tie-up is going out
Nira: No, but then the question is about Azhagiri, no?
Raja: Huh?
Nira: Azhagiri’s people are saying: why is Maran getting Cabinet when he is such a senior leader himself?
Raja: That is different, but all these things must be explored and disclosed
Nira: That’s right. That’s right. I told her to get Congress…
Raja: At least, one to one, let it be disclosed to Leader
Nira: One to one?
Raja: One to one. Somebody should give a message, at least in a sealed cover, that we are having serious problems to Baalu
Nira: From Congress, right?
R: Yes
N: Okay, I’ll tell her. She is talking to Ahmed Patel, so I will talk to him
Raja: Let him [sic] call at least over phone: Sir, this is problem… we are having high regard, we are having no problem with Raja, but problem is Baalu. Tell.
Nira: Then how will you resolve the other problem?
Raja: Other problems we will take care of slowly, because now Leader comes down
Nira: Uh huh.
R: Don’t worry
N: Now Leader comes down to three, no?
Raja: Comes down for [sic] three…
Nira: Yeah
Raja: Even you are saying that Maran is not fit for infrastructure… he is having controversy… alright, let him be accommodated in the existing ministry… at least we will suggest
Nira: Maran?
Raja: Hmm… you suggest, you send a message
Nira: Uh, huh
Raja: Okay
Nira: Okay
***
May 22, 2009, 13:20:29
NIRA calling RAJA. Put on hold
RAJA: Tell me, Nira
NIRA: The thing is that the Congress has been totally confused as to who they need to speak to.
RAJA: Huh?
NIRA: Who they need to speak to in the DMK
RAJA: Ah… somebody should fly to Leader
NIRA: No, no… That is why, I am now… they’re going to speak to Kani in a little while, and then Kani is going to take them to Leader directly, and let Kani…
RAJA: That is good, that is good.
NIRA: Yeah? I have done… just told them that, because they’re completely confused who to talk to. Yeah?
RAJA: Let them talk to Kani
NIRA: Yeah, but Kani should also be sensible enough to say that she does not want anything for herself. No? I have told her that…
RAJA: Hmm
NIRA: …but you also make sure.
RAJA: No problem
NIRA: I told them. I told them that whatever…
RAJA: See, tell Kani: let her call Leader, (tell him) this is the problem, shall I bring the people?
NIRA: Yeah, because what they’re saying is that they will not give to Baalu and Maran. They should say that to Leader directly, no?
RAJA: No problem. Look See… let them go along with Kani, and let them tell that we are having problem with these fellows
RAJA: That’s right. That’s what they have to do… they were confused… what happened is: for the UPA meeting, Maran went along… so they think Maran is the interlocutor, he is the person who’s going to talk, so there is this…
RAJA: Not at all. He came for assistance, that’s all
NIRA: No. I know, but you see this is a wrong message that has gone out, and they don’t know
[AUDIO ENDS]
May 23, 2009, 14:29:41
NIRA: Raja how are you?
RAJA: Haan, What she is telling, Kani is telling?
NIRA: She’s telling that she’s okay about it. She has no problem…
RAJA: Hmm
NIRA: …but the only thing is that somebody has to go talk to Azhagiri, which you have to do.
RAJA: Hmm
NIRA: And tell him how Maranhas gone and told…
RAJA: Haan, I already spoke with him, I already spoke with him…
NIRA: You told him what he has told the Congress leaders in Delhi?
RAJA: I know. So who planted in the minds of the Congress saying that Azhagiri doesn’t know English… I know…
NIRA: No, no, no, no…. Not only that. Not only that. That he and Stalin tomorrow will be the only ones left to run the party because the old man is senile and he is not going to be around any longer, and therefore Congress will be happy doing business with him because it will be him… him eventually, and he controls Stalin.
RAJA: Hmm…
NIRA: This is what he has said.
RAJA: Oh, ho, ho, ho!
NIRA: And that Azhagiri is criminal…
RAJA: Hmm…
NIRA: And he has not even studied more than 5th standard.
RAJA: Oh…
NIRA: That’s the exact thing that he has told.
RAJA: Okay, okay
NIRA: You go and tell him this, no?
RAJA: No I shared with Azhagiri…Azhagiri in turn went to speak with Leader.
NIRA: No, but he has also said this… that in Delhi, I am the only one that you have to deal with eventually because, any case, Stalin will remain in the State
RAJA: I know, see, I know what type of propaganda he will manage…
***
May 24, 2009, 11:05:11
Nira: Hi!
Raja: Hello?
Nira: Hi!
Raja: Tell me.
Nira: Mr Raja?
Raja: Yes?
Nira: Nira
Raja: Tell me, Nira, anything?
Nira: I sent you an SMS. I’ve been speaking to Kani, so I just thought that… basically what they are saying is that you should be there.
Raja: Haan
Nira: Leader is generally is saying that you should be there, because of the, you know, the Dalit dispensation, all that, you know. The Dravidian, the party, and all that… saying that Leader, if it was left to him, he would have focused on the party first. This is unfortunate that his family is coming in the way and Cho Ramaswamy has given a favourable remark that it should be limited to this thing
Raja: Okay
Nira: But I’ve been talking to Kani, she spoke to me, she said, “No independent.” They are not giving independent… just now.
Raja: My case is clear, yes?
Nira: Yours is clear, yeah. Your case was cleared last night only
Raja: Okay
Nira: No, but what is happening with Daya?
Raja: What?
Nira: Daya?
Raja: Rest of the thing is… Textiles or Fertilisers
Nira: Not for Daya…
Raja: Either of them.
Nira: But Azhagiri or Daya? Only one can come, no?
Raja: No, two. Two can come.
Nira: Both?
Raju: Baalu will be the problem. I hope [sic]
Nira: I think that will be difficult for the Leader to justify three family members.
Raja: That is it, that is… (chuckles) everybody knows
Nira: No, no, she said that. Kani told me this last night, that’s what the father told her yesterday.
R: Oh
N: That for him to justify three family members will become very difficult. He recognises that problem.
Raja: What can you do? We’ll see, let us wait.
Nira: Yeah. I think he will have to relook at that. You’re all meeting him individually now? Or the meeting is still going on?
Raja: Not at all, not at all.
Nira: Narayanan’s meeting is going on?
Raja: Narayanan’s meeting is over. He has gone to Delhi, with cover.
Nira: He’s gone to?
Raja: He has gone to catch the flight… with cover.
Nira: Narayanan, yeah?
Raja: List, list…with the list, he has gone out.
Nira: He has gone out with the list, no?
Raja: I didn’t know what is inside the cover.
Nira: And Kani? Is with father?
Raja: Maybe yes… maybe she knows.
Nira: I will call her now. And you are not there?
Raja: I am not yet there.
Nira: You’re not there? And Maran? Maran is there, no?
Raja: (He is) there, yes
Nira: Why you didn’t go?
Raja: I didn’t go.
Nira: Huh?
Raja: Alright… why should we go?
Nira: You should be there, no?
Raja: No problem… morning I met, and thereafter I came back for another work
Nira: And Azhagiri… he knows what Maran has been saying about him?
Raja: …it is known to Azhagiri.
Nira: It is, no?
Raja: It is known to Azhagiri, but he cannot talk with father… timely (sic) he will speak, only thing is, Maran will start the campaign against me…
N: Hmm
R: …that has to be taken care of
Nira: You have to fight differently.
R: Hmm… he may tell the press Prime Minister is coming again… this and that… spectrum…
Nira: No, no… we are handling… don’t worry. We have to take so much off, you know, even Congress had to make that statement, no? I spoke to Sunil Mittal…Did Chandoliya tell you?
Raja: I didn’t know
Nira: I told him to stop. I told him, it doesn’t help…
Raja: Hmm …tell Sunil Mittal, you have to work along with Raja for another five years. So, don’t …
Nira: I told him that. I told him that. But then you also have to distance yourself from Anil. You must be neutral.
Raja: Ah that we can keep.
Audio Files:
22 May 2009, 09:48:51
Nira: Hello?
Raja: Raja here
Nira: Hi! I got a message from Barkha Dutt just now
Raja: Huh?
Nira: Barkha Dutt
Raja: What does she say?
Nira: She says… that she has been following up the story with Prime Minister’s tonight. In fact, she was the one who told me that Sonia Gandhi went there. She says that he has no problem with you, but he has a problem with Baalu
Raja: …but it has to be discussed with Leader
Nira: yeah, yeah… he has to discuss with the Leader. He has to tell…
Raja: It will be discussed in the morning… why unnecessarily Congress… [indiscernible] tie-up is going out
Nira: No, but then the question is about Azhagiri, no?
Raja: Huh?
Nira: Azhagiri’s people are saying: why is Maran getting Cabinet when he is such a senior leader himself?
Raja: That is different, but all these things must be explored and disclosed
Nira: That’s right. That’s right. I told her to get Congress…
Raja: At least, one to one, let it be disclosed to Leader
Nira: One to one?
Raja: One to one. Somebody should give a message, at least in a sealed cover, that we are having serious problems to Baalu
Nira: From Congress, right?
R: Yes
N: Okay, I’ll tell her. She is talking to Ahmed Patel, so I will talk to him
Raja: Let him [sic] call at least over phone: Sir, this is problem… we are having high regard, we are having no problem with Raja, but problem is Baalu. Tell.
Nira: Then how will you resolve the other problem?
Raja: Other problems we will take care of slowly, because now Leader comes down
Nira: Uh huh.
R: Don’t worry
N: Now Leader comes down to three, no?
Raja: Comes down for [sic] three…
Nira: Yeah
Raja: Even you are saying that Maran is not fit for infrastructure… he is having controversy… alright, let him be accommodated in the existing ministry… at least we will suggest
Nira: Maran?
Raja: Hmm… you suggest, you send a message
Nira: Uh, huh
Raja: Okay
Nira: Okay
***
May 22, 2009, 13:20:29
NIRA calling RAJA. Put on hold
RAJA: Tell me, Nira
NIRA: The thing is that the Congress has been totally confused as to who they need to speak to.
RAJA: Huh?
NIRA: Who they need to speak to in the DMK
RAJA: Ah… somebody should fly to Leader
NIRA: No, no… That is why, I am now… they’re going to speak to Kani in a little while, and then Kani is going to take them to Leader directly, and let Kani…
RAJA: That is good, that is good.
NIRA: Yeah? I have done… just told them that, because they’re completely confused who to talk to. Yeah?
RAJA: Let them talk to Kani
NIRA: Yeah, but Kani should also be sensible enough to say that she does not want anything for herself. No? I have told her that…
RAJA: Hmm
NIRA: …but you also make sure.
RAJA: No problem
NIRA: I told them. I told them that whatever…
RAJA: See, tell Kani: let her call Leader, (tell him) this is the problem, shall I bring the people?
NIRA: Yeah, because what they’re saying is that they will not give to Baalu and Maran. They should say that to Leader directly, no?
RAJA: No problem. Look See… let them go along with Kani, and let them tell that we are having problem with these fellows
RAJA: That’s right. That’s what they have to do… they were confused… what happened is: for the UPA meeting, Maran went along… so they think Maran is the interlocutor, he is the person who’s going to talk, so there is this…
RAJA: Not at all. He came for assistance, that’s all
NIRA: No. I know, but you see this is a wrong message that has gone out, and they don’t know
[AUDIO ENDS]
May 23, 2009, 14:29:41
NIRA: Raja how are you?
RAJA: Haan, What she is telling, Kani is telling?
NIRA: She’s telling that she’s okay about it. She has no problem…
RAJA: Hmm
NIRA: …but the only thing is that somebody has to go talk to Azhagiri, which you have to do.
RAJA: Hmm
NIRA: And tell him how Maranhas gone and told…
RAJA: Haan, I already spoke with him, I already spoke with him…
NIRA: You told him what he has told the Congress leaders in Delhi?
RAJA: I know. So who planted in the minds of the Congress saying that Azhagiri doesn’t know English… I know…
NIRA: No, no, no, no…. Not only that. Not only that. That he and Stalin tomorrow will be the only ones left to run the party because the old man is senile and he is not going to be around any longer, and therefore Congress will be happy doing business with him because it will be him… him eventually, and he controls Stalin.
RAJA: Hmm…
NIRA: This is what he has said.
RAJA: Oh, ho, ho, ho!
NIRA: And that Azhagiri is criminal…
RAJA: Hmm…
NIRA: And he has not even studied more than 5th standard.
RAJA: Oh…
NIRA: That’s the exact thing that he has told.
RAJA: Okay, okay
NIRA: You go and tell him this, no?
RAJA: No I shared with Azhagiri…Azhagiri in turn went to speak with Leader.
NIRA: No, but he has also said this… that in Delhi, I am the only one that you have to deal with eventually because, any case, Stalin will remain in the State
RAJA: I know, see, I know what type of propaganda he will manage…
***
May 24, 2009, 11:05:11
Nira: Hi!
Raja: Hello?
Nira: Hi!
Raja: Tell me.
Nira: Mr Raja?
Raja: Yes?
Nira: Nira
Raja: Tell me, Nira, anything?
Nira: I sent you an SMS. I’ve been speaking to Kani, so I just thought that… basically what they are saying is that you should be there.
Raja: Haan
Nira: Leader is generally is saying that you should be there, because of the, you know, the Dalit dispensation, all that, you know. The Dravidian, the party, and all that… saying that Leader, if it was left to him, he would have focused on the party first. This is unfortunate that his family is coming in the way and Cho Ramaswamy has given a favourable remark that it should be limited to this thing
Raja: Okay
Nira: But I’ve been talking to Kani, she spoke to me, she said, “No independent.” They are not giving independent… just now.
Raja: My case is clear, yes?
Nira: Yours is clear, yeah. Your case was cleared last night only
Raja: Okay
Nira: No, but what is happening with Daya?
Raja: What?
Nira: Daya?
Raja: Rest of the thing is… Textiles or Fertilisers
Nira: Not for Daya…
Raja: Either of them.
Nira: But Azhagiri or Daya? Only one can come, no?
Raja: No, two. Two can come.
Nira: Both?
Raju: Baalu will be the problem. I hope [sic]
Nira: I think that will be difficult for the Leader to justify three family members.
Raja: That is it, that is… (chuckles) everybody knows
Nira: No, no, she said that. Kani told me this last night, that’s what the father told her yesterday.
R: Oh
N: That for him to justify three family members will become very difficult. He recognises that problem.
Raja: What can you do? We’ll see, let us wait.
Nira: Yeah. I think he will have to relook at that. You’re all meeting him individually now? Or the meeting is still going on?
Raja: Not at all, not at all.
Nira: Narayanan’s meeting is going on?
Raja: Narayanan’s meeting is over. He has gone to Delhi, with cover.
Nira: He’s gone to?
Raja: He has gone to catch the flight… with cover.
Nira: Narayanan, yeah?
Raja: List, list…with the list, he has gone out.
Nira: He has gone out with the list, no?
Raja: I didn’t know what is inside the cover.
Nira: And Kani? Is with father?
Raja: Maybe yes… maybe she knows.
Nira: I will call her now. And you are not there?
Raja: I am not yet there.
Nira: You’re not there? And Maran? Maran is there, no?
Raja: (He is) there, yes
Nira: Why you didn’t go?
Raja: I didn’t go.
Nira: Huh?
Raja: Alright… why should we go?
Nira: You should be there, no?
Raja: No problem… morning I met, and thereafter I came back for another work
Nira: And Azhagiri… he knows what Maran has been saying about him?
Raja: …it is known to Azhagiri.
Nira: It is, no?
Raja: It is known to Azhagiri, but he cannot talk with father… timely (sic) he will speak, only thing is, Maran will start the campaign against me…
N: Hmm
R: …that has to be taken care of
Nira: You have to fight differently.
R: Hmm… he may tell the press Prime Minister is coming again… this and that… spectrum…
Nira: No, no… we are handling… don’t worry. We have to take so much off, you know, even Congress had to make that statement, no? I spoke to Sunil Mittal…Did Chandoliya tell you?
Raja: I didn’t know
Nira: I told him to stop. I told him, it doesn’t help…
Raja: Hmm …tell Sunil Mittal, you have to work along with Raja for another five years. So, don’t …
Nira: I told him that. I told him that. But then you also have to distance yourself from Anil. You must be neutral.
Raja: Ah that we can keep.
Audio Files:
- 06-188819-0-03-20090522-014237
- 11-188819-0-31-20090524-110511
- 28-188819-0-19-20090522-132029
- A Raja50-188819-0-27-20090523-142941
- A Raja-06-188819-0-03-20090522-014237
- A Raja-28-188819-0-19-20090522-132029
- A Raja–11-188819-0-31-20090524-110511
The Raja-Radia Tapes Four transcripts that were submitted to the SC along with a total of eight recordings in May 2009 covering the cabinet formation, DMK politics and who’d get telecom portfolio We have not edited or changed the style or spellings used in the transcripts submitted to court. Please allow a few seconds to…